Discussions of Mormons and Mormon life, Book of Mormon issues and evidences, and other Latter-day Saint (LDS) topics.

Wednesday, April 12, 2017

Too Complex! Don't Confuse Me with that Military-Industrial Thing

I am surprised how many Americans who care deeply about politics and current events don't seem to have considered the forces that act on and influence government. During a recent conversation with a highly educated business leader, I responded to his enthusiasm over President Trump with my concerns about the obvious nurturing of the very swamp he claimed he would drain. "He's surrounding himself with critters from the swamp, the big industrial and banking forces of the military-industrial complex, and now he's planning to increase their already incredibly bloated budget. More spending, more debt, more military involvement where we have no right to be. It's a heyday for military-industrial complex, but this will mean further loss and sorrow for Americans and many others." There was a puzzled reaction. "The military-industrial complex? What's that?"

He was a keen student of current events and was well read in a number of areas. But he, like perhaps millions of Americans, had never even heard of a key issue in American and global politics. Americans have been trained to instantly drop any discussion of "dark powers" such as the Establishment, the Deep State, the military-industrial complex, etc., into a mental black hole called "lunatic conspiracy theories."

What? You mean that there might be people with a VESTED INTEREST in the spending of hundreds of billions of dollars? Are you trying to say that someone profits from trillions of dollars of American debt and would actually want to keep that cash cow flowing?? Are you saying that when government spends truckloads of money, it goes somewhere, and some people profit, and try to keep that profit coming?? Stuff my ears with wax, this is America, and you are an evil man to say such things about this great country! The military-industrial complex thanks you for your cooperation.

That hated and ignored term did not originate from kooks living in a cave. It was introduced by one of America's most famous generals who learned firsthand how powerful that complex was during his tenure as President of the United States. That was Dwight Eisenhower in his troubling farewell speech, where he gave a muted word of warning to America about the future dangers of the growing complex. This was back when the military-industrial complex was in its infancy, just a little but dangerous toddler compared to the Godzilla-sized bully that will sucks over 500 billion dollars a year out of productive sectors of the economy to feed the swamp and enable ongoing blood and horror on this earth. To see that there are big corporations that benefit from big spending is not a conspiracy theory, folks. It's Business 101. To see that companies with a vested interest in government largess spend big bucks to keep bigger bucks flowing their way is again not a conspiracy theory, though there are surely many hidden deals and actions that would shock us if we knew of them and would fall into the realm of conspiracy, but the basic forces and flows and influences are easy to understand, just Business 101. Or Business as Usual 101 under Trump.

Trump is fully committed to the goals of the Complex. I guess he has to be. He was in trouble politically, but now that he dropped some bombs on Syria, absent any act of war from them against our borders, absent any declaration of war from Congress, absent genuine evidence of a need to invade this country on the other side of the world, suddenly he's found acceptance. Slaps on the back, praise, applause. The Complex is pleased. America is back. Great again. Here we go.

The Book of Mormon has a few things to say about this era and about the workings of megalomaniacs (sometimes on the throne, sometimes behind, sometimes part of a broad network of aligned interests) in an insane quest for power. This would be a good time to study its words and to understand how the sometimes not-so-secret combinations work. It's not all that complex, actually. Much of it is Business 101, though the details may be shrouded in mystery. The results, though, are easy to see: blood and horror on this earth, and big bucks for the Big Boys. The Complex thanks you for your donations and for the ongoing sacrifice of the value of your dollar. And for the sons and daughters you send into unnecessary war zones all over the world to keep the swamp secure.

15 comments:

Mormography said...

"absent genuine evidence" ? Is Mormanity siding against the Allies and with Russia? So Mormanity, what genuine evidence do you have that the recent chemical attack was a false flag secret combination?

Mormography said...

Mormanity is an interesting study. Usually favoring nuance rather than stark contrast, on the topic here he does not. Even more unusual is using the BoM to argue pacifism. The BoM is full of war necessity and strategy. It even opens with an idealized superhero dealing with the internal struggle of the necessity to behead a corrupt dictator for the sake of future generations. Mormanity usually declares criticism easy and urges charity in discourse, something he appears to abandon on the topic of war.

So, if criticism is so easy, what difficult solution does Mormanity offer? Is all fair in war? If war is to be constrained, who enforces the rules? The UN (seriously?)? Waiting to hear Mormanity's solution ......

Mormography said...

The ancient Israelites faced a similar situation. They demanded a king to solve the Philistines conflicts. The Prophet Samuel was skeptical that the larger tribes merely wanted one their households to be king. So, absent any divine guidance to solve the Philistine problem, the Prophet Samuel picked a king from the smallest household of the smallest tribe. Samuel's plan did not work, the larger tribes still ended up taking over the kingship. However, kingship did appear to eventual end the Philistine conflict, only to fail to solve others such as the Babylonian conflict.

So what solution does the living prophet offer today? Build a wall (missle shield), city of Enoch-style border control, and allow a free-for-all war on the other side of the border?

Jeff Lindsay said...

Touche, Mormography, you've learned well from the media and the Complex. Paint anyone asking questions as a collaborator with the Russians! I hope you'll start to break free from the conditioned reflexes that Americans and many Europeans have under the monotone trance-inducing manipulated news. The Russians, the Russian, the Russians... How ironic that real conservatives now get shouted down with McCarthy-like taunts of being part of a "vast Russian conspiracy."

As for evidence, my dear sir, when there's a dead white body and a mob is ready to lynch the closest black man for the crime, if I object to the absence of evidence, the burden of proof is not on me to prove that the black man is innocent. Before someone gets hanged, there should be clear and convincing evidence that the accused actually did the crime.

Peter Ford, former UK ambassador to Syria, shocked BBC recently when he challenged the party line of "blame Assad" for the recent chemical issue in Syria. This expert on Syria said: "What’s needed is an investigation, because there are two possibilities for what happened. One is the American version, that Assad dropped chemical weapons on this locality. The other version is that an ordinary bomb was dropped and it hit a munitions dump where jihadis were storing chemical weapons. We don’t know which of these two possibilities is the correct one.

“Remember the run up to Iraq. The experts, the intelligence agencies, the politicians were convinced that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction. They produced reams of evidence, photographs, diagrams. They were all wrong. It was all wrong. It’s possible that they are wrong in this instance as well. That they are just looking for a pretext to attack Syria.”

But it's also possible that another group staged the attack. In any case, an investigation is needed, not an invasion. Further, the motives for Assad doing such a thing seem completely lacking. Completely non-strategic. Very odd. Shouldn't we do a little fact-checking and thinking before we let one man start unloading bombs and creating another unconstitutional war that could make all of us suffer? Or do bombs make America great again, as the media seems to think, even when nearly all of them miss?

In a world where warring groups, power seekers, and madmen of all sorts are at play, one must recognize that specific crimes and atrocities may not be as simple as they seem, and they there can be a variety of motives and a variety of potential perpetrators that should be considered. Using an apparent atrocity to stir up anger and lead to someone's desired outcome of war, or eliminating an enemy, is not that rare, I'm sad to say. Remember how Hitler blamed the Jews for the Kristallnacht fire? Or maybe you remember the Iraq War and all the horrific weapons of mass destruction that were used to justify that war for the sacred cause of the Complex, a war sold to us in the name of driving out a dictator from the throne of Kuwait so the rightful dictator could get back on his throne? It came at the cost of over a hundred thousand Iraqi lives and many billions of dollars, unleashing a storm of hate against America that will hurt us for decades. But we protected the petrodollar, by golly. And now, thanks to our liberating of Iraq, Islam is the State religion in a land that used to tolerate Christians well, and now they are being driven out, largely thanks to our liberation. Well played! Think of how much more good we're going to do when we start war with Syria, Russia, Iran -- it's breathtaking to consider, if you're one big boys ready to profit.

Jeff Lindsay said...

I prefer the Book of Mormon's guidance on war. Justified when attacked, used for self-defense, not profit or the quest for power or vengeance. Not justified to go striking others first. No justification for invading nations on the other side of the world because we don't like something that happened, or prefer the old dictator versus the new one. The fact that Exxon or some other company has "vital interests" in every nation does not give us the right to tell any other nation what to do or who should be their dictator or whose fishing island belongs to whom. It's not our business, but it clearly is the business of some very large players who use their influence for profit. Throw their influence off if we really want to make America great again.

Mormography said...

Got it. You paint anyone who questions those who challenge the preponderance of evidence as a product of “media and the Complex”. Put a cherry on top with references to racism … Now who is the conspiracy theorist. At least you are not denying that chemical weapons were used, I mean you would not anyone to think you are crazy. (ASIDE - I surprised you did not use the sinking of the Maine example, which historians have proven was an accident)

While Eisenhower coined the phrase Military-Industrial complex, Adam Smith first explained it, revolutionizing economic thought in the process. I suspect you, I, Adam Smith, annnd Donald Trump agree the cost of war often exceeds the benefit. Trump’s campaign was just that. Other countries do not spend for their defense because America will. A large welfare check. Now, even his conservative supporters are less than thrilled … it’s a complex world.

It does not cease to interest me, that vastly more intelligent people than myself, have difficulty resisting our innate human tendency to simplify complexity – it is all about a quest for power, money, and vengeance. If only it was just that simple.

I am not saying your isolation approach is wrong. Japan is the only country to truly achieved isolationism, lasting about 300 years before the military gap caught up with it. What I am saying is America has tried isolationism more than once. Thomas Jefferson tried severing trade relationship with Europe, but failed. Trade relationship dragged the US against its desire into WWI. FDR pretended to be an isolation, that failed …… I don’t have the answers.

Evangelicals and Mormons alike are waiting for Armageddon. Maybe allowing no-holds-barred war is the best way to bring on the rapture.

Anonymous said...

Doesn't the church teach that we are all brothers and sisters? We are all a great family. Missionaries seak out their misguided brothers and sisters all over the world in an attempt to help them believe an American religion. And yet, if we attempt to aid or protect those same brothers and sisters using our military power, it's because there's money in it. I see institutions reaping financial gain in both instances.

If we see injustice happening in the world and we have the ability to help, what does it say about us if we refuse that help? Are we our brother's keeper? Did the Nephites stand by and watch the Anti-Nephi-Lehi's get slaughtered? The protected them because they weren't in a position to protect themselves. Are we only supposed to aid Christian nations?

Isolationism only leads to chaos outside of our borders, which eventually will find its way to our borders. WWII was a perfect example of this.

Mormography said...

Anon - The key to your "if" was "and we have the ability to help." Helping is not from lack of trying, the "help" so often doesn't work or makes things worse. Ultimately each cultural has to decide to change from within. South Korean is the only major success going from a major foreign aid recipient to a major foreign aid contributor.

Mormography said...

Complexity to simplify complexity.

Mormanity declares that despite opening with the beheading of a defenseless drunkard in the street, the BoM advocates violence in self-defense only.

Mormanity declares he does not need evidence when accusing others of faking evidence.

Mormanity simplifies the complexities of geopolitics with intricate schemes of secret combinations.

Mormanity provides complex, convoluted, and contradicting reasoning to explain the difficulties arising from the simplistic answers provided by religion.

Maybe it is better to just embrace complexity.

JR said...



https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/04/10/recording-of-secretary-kerry-admitting-president-obama-armed-extremists-in-syria-and-now-secretary-tillerson-and-president-trump-are-dealing-with-consequences/

Audio of former Secretary of State John Kerry admitting Obama armed and funded ISIS. Other traitors who hold political office, like John McCain for one, also was involved with helping Obama help ISIS.

JR said...



https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/04/08/syria-it-doesnt-matter-who-used-the-chemical-weapons-the-issue-is-extremism-and-stability/#comments

Please read this article that is linked. Will help explain why missiles were sent into Syria.


The article Mr. Lindsay wrote has some good truths in it. Some things are questionable.

Trump never declared he would be an isolationist. Trump ssid he would bomb the you know what out of ISIS. Trump said he would rebuild the military. There is nothing wrong with a strong military in peace time.

Yes, just about every politician wants war. They are greedy and corrupt. As long as Trump is President, war will be a last resort.

Trump did not break any law with the missile strike on Syria.

Obama did worse, and even targeted civilians, and no one said a word!
Oh right, forgot, Obama is a god and did no wrong! The fact that Trump does things that Obama did, and gets skewered for it shows how political and biased, and orchestrated the attacks on Trump are.

Trump has enemies surrounding him in DC and he must walk a very fine line. The main reason why everyone fought him so hard, and continue to do so, is because Trump will not bow to the Communist Globalist agenda. Trump actually wants to help every American citizen, even the ones that hate him.

Every politician in Washington DC is a Uniparty Communist Globalist, except for a handful. Even the Mormon politicians are Communist Globalists. Senator Flake, a "cough" Mormon, is funded almost entirely by a former Nazi and an open Communist, George Soros. Just because someone is a Mormon does not automatically make them a good person. Unfortunately most Mormons think all other Mormons are good honest people, and they especially believe this about the politician Mormons. Even the Mormon Salt Lake City Leaders lean with the Communist Globalists, especially because the Mormon politicians have their ears.

And Russia is not an enemy to the United States. Obama and the Communist Dhimmicrats and traitor Communist Republicans made Russia a scapegoat for various reasons.....a pipeline in the Middle East, Ukraine, Syria, kicking out of Russia Communist Globalist organizations.

Even if and when Trump makes mistakes, he is a million times better than Hillary Clinton.

The United States got a reprieve from the Communist agenda. Unfortunately people are too stupid to realize what is really going on.

The Western media is owned by 6 people and corporations, and all 6 support the Communist Globalist agenda......destroy Western civilization, destroy Christianity, annihilate Caucasions. And these are not conspiracy theories. It is truth. The Communist Globalists no longer hide their agenda. The Communist media is working against the United States and the entire Western world, with false narratives, out right lies, deception, and corruption. We are gas lighted constantly. The Communist media has orders to destroy Trump.

Facebook, Twitter, and Google are helping the Communist Globalists agenda with censorship, even in the United States. Facebook just deleted 30,000 accounts from France because the anti Communist Globalist Marine Le Pen is too popular and those Facebook accounts supported Le Pen.




Anonymous said...

I just caught the words "Western media" in the above post as I was scrolling up from the bottom and thought to myself "this must be another JR rant." Happy to not be disappointed ;-).

JR said...

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/04/16/sunday-talks-dr-sebastian-gorka-interview-with-maria-bartiromo/#comments

Mr. Lindsay please watch this video. Do. Gorka states Trump's position.
Thank you.

Mormography said...

JR – It seems we all agree the world is complex. You seem to explain the complexity with intricate schemes of conspiracy -- absent the schemes, the world would be simple. I am not convinced.

I saw Tom Clancy declare Lee Harvey Oswald and Arch Duke Ferdinand’s assassin operated alone. Tom Clancy theorized it makes humans uncomfortable to believe a single insignificant person can change the course of humanity, ergo we want to believe in conspiracy theories.

Economist Pierre Rinfret had a website years ago regarding why currency exchange markets are so difficult to predict. His experience indicated that each bank had internal fail safes for a variety of conditions that no one entity in each bank fully knew. All the central banks operating at the same time made the results difficult to predict.

Physicists tend to say that behavior of three interacting bodies is difficult to predict. Equations for a single body pendulum, two body pendula, but not three body pendula. However, macro behavior can be determined, such as Boyle’s law of chaotic gases.

I am not convinced that absent your or Mormanity's theorized schemes, the world would be any less complex.

Anonymous said...

JR reminds me of another great thinker in history:

"Well it's a well-known fact, sonny-jim, that there's a secret society of the 5 wealthiest people in the world, known as The Pentavirate, who run everything in the world including the newspapers, and meet tri-annually in a secret country mansion in Colorado known as The Meadows. (So who's in this Pentavirate?) The Queen, the Gettys, the Rothschilds, the Vatican...and Colonel Sanders before he went tits up! Ooh I hated the Colonel, with his wee beady eyes and that smug look on his face! Ohh you're gonna buy my chicken! Ooh! (Dad, how can you hate the Colonel?) Because he puts an addictive chemical in his chicken that makes you crave it fortnightly!"