tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post19102853809872101..comments2023-11-02T07:25:45.884-05:00Comments on Mormanity - a blog for those interested in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints: Lessons from Another Frozen Yogurt FAIL: Troubling Utah StatisticsJeff Lindsayhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08776493593387402607noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-63617813898967241802011-08-15T16:20:30.736-05:002011-08-15T16:20:30.736-05:00So while the snarkers like to point out that some ...So while the snarkers like to point out that some people officially leave the church, and inactivity rates increase, they are missing the bigger picture: <br /><br />1. The <i>active</i> membership is <i>still growing</i> in numbers, among those born-in-the-church and among converts. <i>Both</i> of those groups are increasing in numbers.<br /><br />2. The organization structure is growing, with new branches, wards, and stakes.<br /><br />3. The number of chapels and temples is growing.<br /><br />4. The church is establishing a presence in more and more places.<br /><br />5. More and more non-members are being exposed to the LDS gospel.Bookslingerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15077778974473538408noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-71545382265375558042011-08-15T16:14:29.514-05:002011-08-15T16:14:29.514-05:00New (additional) LDS stakes and congregations are ...New (additional) LDS stakes and congregations are being created all across the US, and new (additional, not just replacement) chapels are being built. <br /><br />So whatever the <i>percentage</i> of Mormons who are "active" is, the overall number of Mormons who are sitting in the pews Sunday keeps increasing, both in the US and in other countries. <br /><br />Rates of inactivity are higher outside the US, but the organizational trend and the construction trend still holds: new branches, wards, and stakes continue to be created.Bookslingerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15077778974473538408noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-14141348556842764952011-08-10T07:14:07.623-05:002011-08-10T07:14:07.623-05:00People tend to connect anything that happens in Ut...People tend to connect anything that happens in Utah with Mormons because they are so predominant throughout the state. Also, statistics don't lie, but you can lie very well with statistics.daveja vunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-480664153711588982011-08-09T07:43:51.965-05:002011-08-09T07:43:51.965-05:00BTW, I was inactive for the better part of a decad...BTW, I was inactive for the better part of a decade, and have just recently come back to the Church. I couldn't be happier with that. Interesting to note that our current Elders Quorum President has been back now for two years after having asked to have his records removed from the Church.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-71447870054926218062011-08-09T07:35:32.909-05:002011-08-09T07:35:32.909-05:00My experience with people in this country and in E...My experience with people in this country and in Europe suggests that religion plays an increasingly small part, if any, in their lives, regardless of denomination. Being an agnostic or Atheist is more and more the norm, it appears. Depending on the study you wish to read, church attendance and activity is down across the board. Some studies conflict with one another, of course. <br /><br />My point is that the decline in attendance and activity is universal, across the board, and not merely endemic to the Latter Day Saints.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-8574866569899972632011-08-09T01:47:21.842-05:002011-08-09T01:47:21.842-05:00Wonder what the independent surveys were talking a...Wonder what the independent surveys were talking about, then. I wonder if the BYU Law Professor considered whether "leave" was defined as a sort of absence or if they only counted those who claimed to no longer be Mormon.<br /><br />There are other ways the numbers could be buffed, though. Not all exmormons come out and claim their beliefs--be it out of apathy, fear of rejection, or, especially, fear of losing their marriage.Openmindedhttp://omsthought.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-44059819869639794662011-08-08T21:43:11.793-05:002011-08-08T21:43:11.793-05:00I am interested in getting my name removed from th...I am interested in getting my name removed from the records. I don't consider myself a mormon and have concerns over some of the teachings of Joseph Smith. <br /><br />Fortunately its been about 3 years since I last went to a ward meeting and the phone calls and letters have slowed to just a few a year.<br /><br />I am attending another church every sunday and as far as my relationship with Jesus some months I'm better than others. Its a constant work in progress.<br /><br />I'm sure LDS will say I'm rejecting Jesus by wanting to leave but its actually me rejecting the views of the LDS church only. I'm also sure LDS views this as me not being 'eligible' to go to the highest level of heaven but I would rather let Jesus decide that than my name in some database in Utah.<br /><br />Initially I started my path out of LDS with hurt and anger. Seeing the LDS past, LDS teachings etc. After all these years I'm just to the point where I want to leave in a peaceful manner without everyone getting upset.<br /><br />I don't deny Jesus in any way. Jesus is the Christ.<br /><br />ThanksAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-89260159918403204772011-08-08T15:02:14.714-05:002011-08-08T15:02:14.714-05:00When I teach my students, we talk about "ecol...When I teach my students, we talk about "ecological fallacies" and that seems to be what you are referencing. An ecological fallacy occurs when one erroneously draws conclusions about individuals based solely on the observation of or gathering of data from groups. The example I use for my class is suicide rates in two countries. We could collect data in the aggregate for suicide rates in Great Britain, a predominantly Protestant country, and find that they are much higher than suicide rates in Italy, which is predominantly Catholic. We might mistakenly conclude that suicide rates are higher in Great Britain precisely b/c it is Protestant. Of course, the problem is that we don't know the specific religion of those who committed suicide b/c we didn't gather data at the individual level. I see these kinds of reports all the time and shake my head.Reddzonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09165363287508367903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-31430543846966808482011-08-08T07:51:58.550-05:002011-08-08T07:51:58.550-05:00Actually, everyone who joins the Church leaves it,...Actually, everyone who joins the Church leaves it, eventually, dead or alive. <br /><br />Most who "leave" it while alive are still on the records, though, and just quit coming. About half of the Church is "less active" in typical U.S. wards, but they are still members, and some of them eventually return, as did one of the best church leaders in my former region of Wisconsin and many other great people I've known, and some of the best Mormons I know are non-attenders who are still full of faith and love for the Kingdom of God and serve others, pray, and read the scriptures, but don't attend for various personal reasons. They and I consider them Mormons as well. <br /><br />When someone has their name removed from the records or is excommunicated, they are no longer counted as members of the Church. I don't see how the Church can reasonable report its numbers any other way, except to add average sacrament meeting statistics or other stats that don't reflect Church membership either because people miss Church for all sorts of reasons other than rejecting their membership in it.Jeff Lindsayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08776493593387402607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-88324534754175116162011-08-07T21:25:19.281-05:002011-08-07T21:25:19.281-05:00It reminds me of the quote, "He uses statisti...It reminds me of the quote, "He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lamp-posts...for support rather than illumination."Quantumleap42https://www.blogger.com/profile/16711817313734546305noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7139169.post-3342898551589916662011-08-07T15:58:55.554-05:002011-08-07T15:58:55.554-05:00There's another statistic promoted by the LDS ...There's another statistic promoted by the LDS church that there are over 10 million members.<br /><br />BYU Law Professor, Frederick Gedicks, claims that <a href="http://svu.edu/speeches/forums/2011/frederick-gedicks" rel="nofollow">as many people join the church as leave it</a>: "Anyone who's served a recent mission in Europe knows that the Church is struggling to maintain a demographic peak in those countries that was never very high. Church membership has rarely exceeded one-tenth of one percent of the population of any European country. And even in the United Kingdom, where the Church has a long historical presence, Mormons constitute only three-tenths of one percent of the population.<br />Now church membership, of course, is much stronger in the United States, Mormons make up about 2% of the US population, and there are notable concentrations in California, Utah and other states in the interior west. But even here there are disquieting signs of the challenges we face as a church:<br />membership growth in the United States has been flat during the last decade;<br />independent survey evidence shows that about as many people leave the church now as join it each year;<br />convert baptisms have been declining during this period..."<br /><br />And other estimates drive the number down to about half of what the church claims.Openmindedhttp://omsthought.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.com